Help me with FTE (not on a new pistol)

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FiveDigit
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Help me with FTE (not on a new pistol)

Post by FiveDigit » Wed Feb 06, 2019 12:00 am

Hey guys. I just rejoined. I was a founding member on the old site but lost track when it moved here.

Let me describe my problem:

I have a TP9 SFX. I use the gun in competition and shoot it, let's say frequently. The gun has roughly 25,000 rounds on it.

Mods:
I have a Springco recoil assembly with white spring and Glock striker spring. Been running this for at least 15,000 rounds with no issues till now.
I use hand loaded 147gr ammo that is roughly 130 power factor. Same - been running this recipe for thousands upon thousands of rounds.
I use Taylor Freelance +4 basepads with the grams springs and followers.
Ihave talon grip tape on the grip which was installed just around the time this started happening.

I have never had issues with FTEs or stovepipes up until the last month or so when they become very common (couple per mag).
It happens with multiple magazines. My mag springs are new, roughly 2 months old.

Stuff I have tried:
I swapped out the white RSA spring for a fresh one (the old one had at least 15,000 rounds on it). - This did not help.
I tried an entirely new, lower mileage Springco recoil assembly (the rod and secondary spring part). - This did not help.
I removed the extractor and cleaned the slide out where the extractor fits in (it was absurdly packed with carbon). I then installed all new extractor, extractor spring, extractor pin and pin spring. - This caused the gun to run great for about 80 rounds then I got 4 or 5 stovepipes in a row.
I have inspected the ejector and it looks perfect.


Do you think it is possible that I heated the lower too much whil putting on the talon grips and this has caused some deformation or other issue that could lead to stovepipes? The stovepipes I am getting are severe, like not even a "stove pipe" because the case is fully set into the ejection port and trapped by the slide closing.

This gun has run absolutely flawlessly before this. I mean maybe one failure per 3 or 4 thousand rounds, if that.

So, does anybody have any advice on what else I should try?
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GlennSFX
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Re: Help me with FTE (not on a new pistol)

Post by GlennSFX » Wed Feb 06, 2019 4:51 pm

:-? ......

So it looks like you've addressed the common components that would be the culprit. I have a number of guns that have the Talon grips and I can't imagine heating the lower to set the adhesive would be an issue. I heat mine a couple times after I have it in place, and use my hands to rub and set the grip. It's never so hot that I can't touch it. How hot did you heat the grip when installing the tape...enough so you couldn't touch it?

The only other things I can think of is maybe an issue with the ejector, or something changed in your reloads. Have you tried a heavier RSA and hotter load? I have well over 10K rounds through mine, and I'm basically running the same setup as you without any issues. Been running Federal 150g Syntech for match ammo and about to start reloading my own.

With the barrel out are the reloads sitting freely in the chamber where you can spin them and they drop right out?
With an empty shell or dummy round, and manually racking the slide, do the shells eject properly?

Just throwing ideas out.
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runeight
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Re: Help me with FTE (not on a new pistol)

Post by runeight » Wed Feb 06, 2019 5:05 pm

I read this early morning but wanted to let others comment as the only thing I thought was possibly the barrel like GlennSFX.

Other than that I’m currently out of ideas.
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FiveDigit
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Re: Help me with FTE (not on a new pistol)

Post by FiveDigit » Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:34 pm

Thanks for the replies.

I definitely did not heat it so much that it was too hot to touch.

On the barrel fit of the cartridges, I can try plunk testing some, but I chamber check every single round I make in a case block and reject those that aren't pretty well perfect into a practice ammo bin. In all my use of this gun, even the practice rounds (those that failed chamber check) have never had a FTE! So this thing has been totally bullet proof right up until a couple weeks ago. I know my springs have a lot of wear on them but that apparently wasn't the issue since I replaced the Sprinco and extractor springs (any others I should change out ?).

One fact I left out is that I have 2 SFX's. The original which has the high round count and a new one which has almost no use. The problems I had been having is with the original slide (set up as described above) with the NEW frame which is the one with the talon grips. I don't see why this would present any problem, but today I went out with the entire original gun (except with the new springs I mentioned), the original frame and the original barrel and slide. I went through 150 rounds. I had two of the exact same FTEs as mentioned above. Both were the last round in a magazine (different mags though). So I think I ruled out the lower (which would include ejector) as the problem. I have noticed the FTEs are more common on the last round in the mag, but certainly not exclusive to last round in mag.

I will try the original RSA and factory ammo next and see what happens.
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GlennSFX
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Re: Help me with FTE (not on a new pistol)

Post by GlennSFX » Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:42 pm

FiveDigit wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:34 pm
Thanks for the replies.

I definitely did not heat it so much that it was too hot to touch.

On the barrel fit of the cartridges, I can try plunk testing some, but I chamber check every single round I make in a case block and reject those that aren't pretty well perfect into a practice ammo bin. In all my use of this gun, even the practice rounds (those that failed chamber check) have never had a FTE! So this thing has been totally bullet proof right up until a couple weeks ago. I know my springs have a lot of wear on them but that apparently wasn't the issue since I replaced the Sprinco and extractor springs (any others I should change out ?).

One fact I left out is that I have 2 SFX's. The original which has the high round count and a new one which has almost no use. The problems I had been having is with the original slide (set up as described above) with the NEW frame which is the one with the talon grips. I don't see why this would present any problem, but today I went out with the entire original gun (except with the new springs I mentioned), the original frame and the original barrel and slide. I went through 150 rounds. I had two of the exact same FTEs as mentioned above. Both were the last round in a magazine (different mags though). So I think I ruled out the lower (which would include ejector) as the problem. I have noticed the FTEs are more common on the last round in the mag, but certainly not exclusive to last round in mag.

I will try the original RSA and factory ammo next and see what happens.
  • Scenario 1...all original SFX...
:-? ...So it's not a problem when another round is present in the mag pushing up against the spent round, which helps to pop it out of the ejection port. On the last round there isn't a "follow-up round" and the last spent case is probably falling off of the extractor before it can hit the ejector. BUT...you have changed the extractor, pin, and springs... :-\

Maybe there is some wear in the slide where the extractor pin sits and affecting the extractor operation on the last round... Grasping at straws! ~X(

  • Scenario 2...old SFX slide on new SFX lower...
Couple FTE every mag. Could be the SFX is not a "Gender Neutral" gun!!!!! =))

  • Scenario 3...new upper and new lower...
I take it the new gun together operates perfectly...

  • Scenario 4...new upper and old lower...
Have you tried this configuration for $hits and Giggles???
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FiveDigit
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Re: Help me with FTE (not on a new pistol)

Post by FiveDigit » Sat Mar 09, 2019 5:52 pm

To fill everybody in. So the pistol is back to working 100%. I just shot a Level 3 match yesterday with it. Over 300 rounds, not a single problem. Also two previous matches, comprising anohter 400 rounds with no issues.

What was the problem? Well it appears it was the barrel. Through all my testing I was still using the original barrel. Onces I started using the new barrel, all problems are gone. In fact for the recent 700 or so rounds, I have had the new lower, old slide, new extractor, and new barrel. But no matter what combo I use, as long as the new barrel is part of it, everything functions perfectly.

The question is WHY? I suppose that it has worn enough to allow gasses to escape and thus not have as much power for the operation of the pistol. Do you think this is anything Canik/Century would do anything about? The barrel is supposed to make NATO accuracy for 50k rounds. The accuracy is fine, but the reliability went to no better than 90% at whatever round count I'm at, roughly 25-30k somewhere.
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ncjw
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Re: Help me with FTE (not on a new pistol)

Post by ncjw » Sun Mar 10, 2019 7:10 am

Ah, but you changed a number of variables in the equation. They are supposed to run to 50k rounds absolutely stock with only 124gr NATO spec ammo.

Changing variables changes the outcome.
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FiveDigit
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Re: Help me with FTE (not on a new pistol)

Post by FiveDigit » Sun Mar 10, 2019 2:32 pm

ncjw wrote:
Sun Mar 10, 2019 7:10 am
Ah, but you changed a number of variables in the equation. They are supposed to run to 50k rounds absolutely stock with only 124gr NATO spec ammo.

Changing variables changes the outcome.
I didn't change any variables except for the barrel in this run of testing. I had made all sorts of changes through this process and checked them one at a time, each time getting a failure rate of roughly 10%. Since swapping to the new barrel, the failure rate is 0%. I have even used the new barrel with other combos of upper/lower and still 0% failure rate. As for barrel life - I believe the words are that it will maintain NATO spec accuracy to 50k rounds. Accuracy has been fine, but function has fallen off on this one.

It is, of course, still possible I have just gotten lucky over the past 700 or so rounds. When I next to go out to practice, I could try the old barrel again to see if my issues return. But for now I am just happy that it is functioning at 100% again.
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Re: Help me with FTE (not on a new pistol)

Post by ncjw » Sun Mar 10, 2019 2:55 pm

I think that you misunderstood. By making ANY changes to the stock SFX over the course of the 50k rounds and using ANY ammo other than 124gr NATO voids the expectation that it will run to 50k rounds.

And I am not certain that the expectation that the Canik testing applies to every model is also reasonable. It probably just applies to the duty guns like the DA, SA and SF, not the competition guns like the SFX.
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GlennSFX
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Re: Help me with FTE (not on a new pistol)

Post by GlennSFX » Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:15 pm

:-? ...With the amount of use the gun/barrel has seen...I wouldn't be too concerned about buying a replacement barrel.
That's just me.
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FiveDigit
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Re: Help me with FTE (not on a new pistol)

Post by FiveDigit » Thu Mar 21, 2019 6:06 pm

GlennSFX wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:15 pm
:-? ...With the amount of use the gun/barrel has seen...I wouldn't be too concerned about buying a replacement barrel.
That's just me.

Except they aren't available for purchase are they?? I don't want a threaded barrel and that's all I have seen.
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GlennSFX
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Re: Help me with FTE (not on a new pistol)

Post by GlennSFX » Thu Mar 21, 2019 7:43 pm

FiveDigit wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 6:06 pm
GlennSFX wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:15 pm
:-? ...With the amount of use the gun/barrel has seen...I wouldn't be too concerned about buying a replacement barrel.
That's just me.

Except they aren't available for purchase are they?? I don't want a threaded barrel and that's all I have seen.
Looks like you're right! :sad:
I guess that's just the excuse you need to buy the new SFx "MOD 2" version!!! :lol:
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FiveDigit
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Re: Help me with FTE (not on a new pistol)

Post by FiveDigit » Sun Mar 24, 2019 11:14 am

I sent an inquiry to Century about it. At least to see if I can buy an OEM barrel. Will let you know what they say.
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TL1000RSquid
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Re: Help me with FTE (not on a new pistol)

Post by TL1000RSquid » Sun Mar 24, 2019 11:50 am

Apex was selling factory take offs, dont know if they still got any barrels left or if the price is decent though.
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FiveDigit
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Re: Help me with FTE (not on a new pistol)

Post by FiveDigit » Sun Mar 24, 2019 1:29 pm

TL1000RSquid wrote:
Sun Mar 24, 2019 11:50 am
Apex was selling factory take offs, dont know if they still got any barrels left or if the price is decent though.
I didn't know that, thank you for pointing that out. I just checked and they are out of stock, but still very good to know.
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FiveDigit
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Re: Help me with FTE (not on a new pistol)

Post by FiveDigit » Sat Apr 06, 2019 6:39 pm

Update: I contacted Century about this asking if they felt it was a warranty issue (not demanding anything) and asking if not, is it possible for me to purchase an OEM barrel. After a couple emails, they've put in an order for a replacement OEM barrel for me under warranty. Unfortunately the barrels are back ordered so I don't know when I will get it. Assuming they do follow through, this is awesome customer service from Century. I had previously gotten outstanding support from them on a broken firing pin.
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Re: Help me with FTE (not on a new pistol)

Post by Weapon » Mon Apr 08, 2019 2:36 pm

Are there any scratches or other marks inside the chamber of the original barrel? Any type of build up?
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