Disappointed

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Crosspower
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Re: Disappointed

Post by Crosspower » Tue Dec 04, 2018 6:18 am

FrankW wrote:
Mon Dec 03, 2018 5:48 pm
Have you tried switching barrels between the two guns to compare accuracy. I don’t know how you can judge accuracy shooting offhand. I suggest you shoot from a rest to see the true accuracy of your guns.

Frank
I thought about switching parts around. I haven't though. I did shoot off a table at 29 yards. Not a true rest because I was resting it on the magazine instead of under front of frame. At that distance 4 out of 10 barely hit the bottom of the target. I understand your point, but when you shoot magazine after magazine, 10 rds offhand with identical pistols and consistently one groups around bullseye and other is a foot low there has to be an issue with the pistol. Perhaps after the holidays I'll go out and mix parts around.
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qballbandit
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Re: Disappointed

Post by qballbandit » Tue Dec 04, 2018 9:18 pm

Good evening,
New to the forum, but must say impressed with the vast array of knowledge and intelligent opinions and viewpoints.
I wanted to add some comments re: the Elite-S, Century Support, and receiving replacement parts - all topics I've read about in this thread.
First, I'm sorry to hear of your issues, runeight. Not to beat a dead horse, but my experience with the Elite is mostly positive. Shoots straight, shoots very comfortably, and very easy to be in control of the gun with regards to muzzle flip, recoil, follow-up's, etc.
I do admit, I did not research far enough into the need for NATO class ammo for the "break in", so started suffering the slide lock back failures. I had misread that 124gr or higher was the preferred break in, but missed the NATO part, so was feeding watered 124gr from Fiocchi, Federal, Winchester. This leads me to two of the subjects mentioned above.
I contacted Century, and Robert Pittman promptly replied back. His first suggestion was to remove the slide, and apply upward pressure on the slide lock levers, to release any tension on the springs. I did try this, and Sunday put 300 rounds of non-NATO ammo through the gun (my NATO order had not yet arrived on the doorstep), and only had one failure to lock back, compared to almost 100% failure the prior week.
When I got home, I saw that Robert replied again, and mentioned that he'd sent me a lighter weight replacement spring/guide rod, which I received today.
Point being, for me anyway, I had quick support, and without asking, had a replacement part sent. Now, admittedly, not sure if the tension I applied to the slide lock levers really was the fix, or coincidentally, the gun is broken in after 500 rounds now, can't say.
I'll try another couple hundred non-NATO rounds and see what happens. If all is good, I'll oil and keep the replacement spring/rod tucked away in the "spare parts" box.
I wish you success with your current mission.

Neil
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LT USN (Ret.)
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Re: Disappointed

Post by LT USN (Ret.) » Wed Dec 05, 2018 10:21 am

Century Arms takes care of their owners.
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FreedomFries
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Re: Disappointed

Post by FreedomFries » Mon Jan 14, 2019 5:13 pm

I am a new Canik owner and member to this forum. Perhaps a bit late, but I was wondering if OP's issue has been resolved? Before giving up on the pistol, I would also suggest a trial from a bench rest at 20 yards or so distance. Although the final point of impact fired from bench rest and fired without a rest are sometimes slightly different, it should give you some indication of where the pistol tends to want to impact mechanically as well as whether it consistently impacts in the same area. If it cannot consistently make any sort of group, then your pistol is defective and has an improper lock up, defect with the barrel, or some other mechanical issue.

From the picture you shared on the previous page, it appears the the pistol is capable of grouping even if the results were not as good as your tried and true tungsten colored TP9SF Elite. If further testing shows that the pistol can group consistently but impacts low and right, then you may consider having a gunsmith replace the front sight with a shorter one and drifting it slightly to the right of the original position. This isn't an unusual problem, and I have had to either drift or replace sights on many of my pistols.

If your TP9SF Elite-S is similar to my TP9DA, then the front dovetail has the dimensions cut similarly to an S&W M&P pistol. The height of my Canik TP9DA front sight was about 0.190" above the dovetail (about 0.260" total including the dovetail). The standard M&P9 front sight height is 0.160" above the dovetail (about 0.230" including the dovetail). If you are truly a foot too low, you may need to consider a 0.140" (0.210" total including dovetail) or even lower. Probably will want to take careful measurements of how low the center of your group is and the distance to your gunsmith for a recommendation on front sights change. Ameriglo, Dawson, etc. all make good front sights.
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Crosspower
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Re: Disappointed

Post by Crosspower » Tue Jan 15, 2019 5:53 am

I appreciate your comments FreedomFries. I haven't done anything with this Elite yet. I believe Frank W also suggested shooting it from a rest as well. I'll do it and post the results.
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Hidden
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Re: Disappointed

Post by Hidden » Tue Jan 15, 2019 11:03 am

Could be just a sight issue, swap some parts around. swap barrels first, then slides. range time can be fun AND informative. Don't give up so easy. As you can tell you are going to loose your ass getting rid of it so might as well try and diagnose it. If you could tell Century a little more they may be willing to help. Also it would seem their customer service has gotten better the last year.
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Re: Disappointed

Post by runeight » Tue Jan 15, 2019 4:13 pm

qballbandit...

I don’t own the elite, just the SFx. No plans on buying one either. Too many ahead of the elite on my want list.
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NHNikon
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Re: Disappointed

Post by NHNikon » Tue Feb 12, 2019 6:10 pm

Interesting thread, as I myself have had recent disappointment with an elite I bought. I am just WILD about the burnt bronze/O.D. green color combo now being offered and went bat sht crazy and bought one of each - SFX, SF, and the SF Elite. My first impressions of the Elite were poor, not only for accuracy but ergonomics (will be posting a long overdue range report). Why in the name of the creator did Canik change the grip on the Elite ? I fell in love with the Tungsten Gray SFx (my first Canik) simply because it felt so good in hand. The Elite presents me with the exact issue I had with my G19, grip too fat, can't drop mags without repositioning my hand, and I never shot it well. I have no doubt the Elite is accurate, I shoot it low and left damn near every time. Is it the way I shoot ? Possibly. The sights ? Possibly. Both ? Likely. I will simply say the Elite is radically different from the SFx and the SF.

UPDATE: I have been focusing on running just the Elite for about the last 6 range trips and I can say the issue was with me (no surprise) and not the pistol. While the grip is different, the accuracy is fantastic. WWB124 is all I ever shoot out of my Caniks and the round count on the elite now stands at 500 having burned up the 1/2 case I bought for it. :-D
Last edited by NHNikon on Sun Apr 14, 2019 2:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Crosspower
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Re: Disappointed

Post by Crosspower » Wed Feb 13, 2019 10:40 am

NHNikon wrote:
Tue Feb 12, 2019 6:10 pm
Interesting thread, as I myself have had recent disappointment with an elite I bought. I am just WILD about the burnt bronze/O.D. green color combo now being offered and went bat sht crazy and bought one of each - SFX, SF, and the SF Elite. My first impressions of the Elite were poor, not only for accuracy but ergonomics (will be posting a long overdue range report). Why in the name of the creator did Canik change the grip on the Elite ? I fell in love with the Tungsten Gray SFx (my first Canik) simply because it felt so good in hand. The Elite presents me with the exact issue I had with my G19, grip too fat, can't drop mags without repositioning my hand, and I never shot it well. I have no doubt the Elite is accurate, I shoot it low and left damn near every time. Is it the way I shoot ? Possibly. The sights ? Possibly. Both ? Likely. I will simply say the Elite is radically different from the SFx and the SF.
I like the colors on modern pistols too. Too many years of black or stainless I suppose. Grip size is like shoe size. Even though I have smaller hands I always add the biggest backstrap to my pistols. I like the feel. My wife who has smaller hands likes same. She has totally claimed my tungsten Elite. She even knows it by name now after asking me several times "whats my gun?" Whether the sights and or trigger she shoots it very well.
Weather has been tough to do any accuracy testing. So my green Elite is still sitting.
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Re: Disappointed

Post by Badgerboy » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:41 pm

runeight wrote:
Tue Jan 15, 2019 4:13 pm
qballbandit...

I don’t own the elite, just the SFx. No plans on buying one either. Too many ahead of the elite on my want list.
Star. :-
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runeight
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Re: Disappointed

Post by runeight » Thu Feb 14, 2019 6:19 pm

Badgerboy wrote:
Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:41 pm
runeight wrote:
Tue Jan 15, 2019 4:13 pm
qballbandit...

I don’t own the elite, just the SFx. No plans on buying one either. Too many ahead of the elite on my want list.
Star. :-
Let me hold off on my next purchase, DW 38 Super Guardian and get that instead.

Tough choice. :-\

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Badgerboy
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Re: Disappointed

Post by Badgerboy » Thu Feb 14, 2019 7:27 pm

Problem is that is too pretty to shoot. Very nice.
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runeight
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Re: Disappointed

Post by runeight » Fri Feb 15, 2019 5:51 am

Badgerboy wrote:
Thu Feb 14, 2019 7:27 pm
Problem is that is too pretty to shoot. Very nice.
Yeah, it’s is huh?

I’ve looked at these for a long time. A little higher price now but that’s what you get for waiting. Wish they had the Guardian in a 5 inch barrel. The fit and finish on DW firearms is amazing.
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Crosspower
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Re: Disappointed

Post by Crosspower » Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:43 am

Image Image Image Image Image Image Image

Sunday I got out for the Canik reshoot. Distance to target 24 steps! I know I meant to tape off 25 yards but forgot tape. Ammo Remington and Tul. Both pistols cleaned. I had planned on a little warm up but when the Tungsten Elite put the 1st bullet into the bullseye I decided we were good to go 1st pic. 2nd pic Tungsten 10 rds Rem. 3rd pic 10 rds Green. 4th pic Tunsten 10 rds Tul. 5th pic 10 rds Tul.
I believe the Tul ammo runs about 80-100 fps faster than the Rem. That or the steel case, bi metal bullet, certainly impacts differently. I'm not used to shooting from a rest. I'd have to imagine the flyers are my fault. I still feel the same, tungsten is a great pistol and the green one is only average.
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Crosspower
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Re: Disappointed

Post by Crosspower » Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:54 am

Recap is I bought the tungsten Elite 1st. Man this is a great pistol I thought. Ordered a green one for my collection. Shoots low and right. I filed a claim with Century. The 1st guy pretty much blew me off, I pursued the matter telling them I wanted them to test fire the pistol. They claimed they made a sight adjustment, test fired 15 rds and was right on at 8 yards. There is no sight adjustment to fix being that low. Also the groups are better from the tungsten. The green one is a beauty and works 100% well. I could leave it alone and have a perfectly good home defense pistol. It is not acceptable for IDPA matches though.
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Hidden
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Re: Disappointed

Post by Hidden » Wed Mar 06, 2019 7:06 am

Crosspower wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:54 am
Recap is I bought the tungsten Elite 1st. Man this is a great pistol I thought. Ordered a green one for my collection. Shoots low and right. I filed a claim with Century. The 1st guy pretty much blew me off, I pursued the matter telling them I wanted them to test fire the pistol. They claimed they made a sight adjustment, test fired 15 rds and was right on at 8 yards. There is no sight adjustment to fix being that low. Also the groups are better from the tungsten. The green one is a beauty and works 100% well. I could leave it alone and have a perfectly good home defense pistol. It is not acceptable for IDPA matches though.
You have still not swapped parts around? You're not really helping yourself much.
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Hidden
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Re: Disappointed

Post by Hidden » Wed Mar 06, 2019 7:11 am

https://dawsonprecision.com/sight-calculator/

if nothing else use their sight calculator. They will make custom sights. Should you have to do this, NO but it is an option.
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Crosspower
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Re: Disappointed

Post by Crosspower » Wed Mar 06, 2019 8:19 am

Hidden wrote:
Wed Mar 06, 2019 7:06 am
Crosspower wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:54 am
Recap is I bought the tungsten Elite 1st. Man this is a great pistol I thought. Ordered a green one for my collection. Shoots low and right. I filed a claim with Century. The 1st guy pretty much blew me off, I pursued the matter telling them I wanted them to test fire the pistol. They claimed they made a sight adjustment, test fired 15 rds and was right on at 8 yards. There is no sight adjustment to fix being that low. Also the groups are better from the tungsten. The green one is a beauty and works 100% well. I could leave it alone and have a perfectly good home defense pistol. It is not acceptable for IDPA matches though.
You have still not swapped parts around? You're not really helping yourself much.
It's not my job to diagnose the problem of a new pistol under warranty. That would be Century Arms. I work 50 hrs a week and it's our slow time now. Then there is my wife, kids and grand kids. I really want to go to range to practice and have fun. But the most irritating thing to me is Century had this pistol and had the opportunity to make it right. So they test fired it at 8 yards. That doesn't show accuracy or groupings at 25 yards. We are talking about a pistol that comes with a "match grade barrel". Anything mass produced can have a problem and I'm ok with that. It's how the manufacturer deals with the problem that matters.
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Crosspower
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Re: Disappointed

Post by Crosspower » Tue Mar 12, 2019 9:09 am

I emailed Century again and included my test results. They sent me a return number without hesitation or questioning me. I asked for the pistol to shoot to point of aim at 25 yards, to include a picture of target and to specify what ammo was used to achieve the results. It's a beautiful pistol and if it comes back shooting as well as my other Elite I'm going to be really happy.
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Crosspower
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Re: Disappointed

Post by Crosspower » Mon Apr 01, 2019 9:38 am

The Elite was mailed on Tuesday evening 3/19. Remarkably Century contacted me 1st thing Friday morning 3/22. They said the crown on the barrel is bad. They asked if I would be ok with changing the barrel because it would have a different serial number. I told them I was fine with that. That's the last I heard about it. I'm feeling pretty good about it. It would seem they "really" looked at it this time.
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