Cast Bullets Keyholing

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GaCop
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Cast Bullets Keyholing

Post by GaCop » Tue Apr 23, 2019 6:15 am

Anyone else having trouble getting cast loads to shoot in their Canik? I've tried weights from 122 grains up to 147 grains and they all keyhole on the target. Plain base, bevel base or poly coated, it doesn't matter, they all shoot like crap and keyhole. It's obvious .356" bullets won't shoot in my pistol. This is the first 9mm I've ever owned that wouldn't shoot cast pills. Jacketed/plated bullets shoot great. I'm going to try gas check bullet next to see if that helps.
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GlennSFX
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Re: Cast Bullets Keyholing

Post by GlennSFX » Tue Apr 23, 2019 11:25 am

The bullets will tumble if they are not spun at the right speed to provide gyroscopic stability. It could be the barrel is slightly out of spec and the .356 bullets are not fulling engaging the rifling to provide the proper spin. Maybe you need to slug the barrel to see exactly what size bullet it want.
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Re: Cast Bullets Keyholing

Post by Retiredtrooper » Tue Apr 23, 2019 9:09 pm

I go with the "slug the barrel" idea.
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GaCop
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Re: Cast Bullets Keyholing

Post by GaCop » Wed Apr 24, 2019 4:59 am

Yesterday I tried some 124 grain round nose poly coated bullets from Bayou Bullets. They were loaded over Unique powder and seated to 1.112". I was surprised to see round holes on the target! The bullets miked .356". The best shooting load turned out to be the maximum charge of 3.8 grains grouping into 2.56". I don't know what caused these bullets to shoot better than a number of other brands but, I'll be using more of Bayou's bullets in the future.
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GlennSFX
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Re: Cast Bullets Keyholing

Post by GlennSFX » Wed Apr 24, 2019 5:48 am

GaCop wrote:
Wed Apr 24, 2019 4:59 am
Yesterday I tried some 124 grain round nose poly coated bullets from Bayou Bullets. They were loaded over Unique powder and seated to 1.112". I was surprised to see round holes on the target! The bullets miked .356". The best shooting load turned out to be the maximum charge of 3.8 grains grouping into 2.56". I don't know what caused these bullets to shoot better than a number of other brands but, I'll be using more of Bayou's bullets in the future.
Glad you got some good results.

The "hotter" loads will should have the highest rate of spin, so theoretically, be the most accurate. I tested a number of loads, all with 147g FN and 145g RN, and didn't see any change in accuracy. At least nothing significant. I played around with different COLs and didn't see a significant change there either. I'm loading to achieve a PF of 128-131. Mine chrono right around 880 ft/sec. Right now I'm loading 145g RN with 2.9g of Titegroup and a COL of 1.135" with good results.
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GaCop
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Re: Cast Bullets Keyholing

Post by GaCop » Wed Apr 24, 2019 6:04 am

Not long ago I tried some 147 grain cast truncated cone flat nose bullets (.356") of unknown parentage (have had them lying around for quite some time). The were loaded in Federal brass, CCI 500 primers and HS-6 powder, 4.5 grains up to 4.9 grains in 1/10th increments and bullets seated to 1.127". Best load was 4.5 grains at 924 fps and put four into 1.964" and a flyer opening the group to 5.121" (slight keyholed). Full keyholing reared it's ugly head with the 4.9 grain load that produced 966 fps and sprayed bullets all over the target frame.
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Bub
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Re: Cast Bullets Keyholing

Post by Bub » Thu Apr 25, 2019 7:57 am

.356 cast won't work in most 9s. .356 is what jacketed bullets are sized to. I cast and size to .357 for my Canik. I cast some to.358 I want to try when I get time.
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Texas1911
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Re: Cast Bullets Keyholing

Post by Texas1911 » Thu Apr 25, 2019 4:48 pm

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GaCop
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Re: Cast Bullets Keyholing

Post by GaCop » Fri Apr 26, 2019 4:51 am

I retested the 3.8 grain load with Unique powder and a Bayou Bullets 124 grain poly coat RN. 25 rounds yielded a 3.5" group average at 25 yards. Smallest group was 2.1" and the largest was 4.8"" Not a bad practice load on steel.
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Bub
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Re: Cast Bullets Keyholing

Post by Bub » Sat Apr 27, 2019 7:40 am

You're right Texas. That's what I reload jacketed with. I claim senior moment. Ha.
But we do have options.

Armscor 9mm (.356") Bullets 124 Grain Full Metal Jacket - 2000 Projectiles - Wideners
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Re: Cast Bullets Keyholing

Post by DWARREN123 » Thu May 02, 2019 5:55 pm

Slug barrel or try some .357 or .358 bullets.
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Texas1911
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Re: Cast Bullets Keyholing

Post by Texas1911 » Sat May 11, 2019 1:00 pm

I'm sizing most of my cast bullets to .357, now that I've had the chamber throat opened up I'm going to try some .358 bullets. I slugged my bore and it came out at .3565 so .357 is about as small as I can go.
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GaCop
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Re: Cast Bullets Keyholing

Post by GaCop » Sat May 18, 2019 5:41 am

In my TP9SA, poly coated has been the way to go. No more keyholing. Tested a 125 gr RN poly coat bullet from Gallant Bullets in Utah. Shot that bullet over Unique and 231 with fairly good preliminary results.
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Daniel44114
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Re: Cast Bullets Keyholing

Post by Daniel44114 » Sat Oct 12, 2019 5:20 pm

I run that bullet (Super Red Hawk) gas checked with WW or softer a little hotter, 21 grains of H110 and get no tumble or leading. I think that bullet is long enough to get by with a softer alloy. It's a Thumper!
If you go softer, be sure you are not sizing the bullet down when you seat it, in other words, be sure your expander plug is fat enough for cast.
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