Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Basic Firearm and Defensive Skills and Training Discussion Section.
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Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Post by Ghostwolf308 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:22 pm

Original post by ssgndoc on the old Canik Fanatik Forum

The idea behind this section is to address shooting skills as a whole. It is for the spectrum of shooting skills beginning with basics, or for more advanced topics.

Posters here should feel feel free to inquire about setting goals, establish goals, and track them here. You can make your own shooting journal on line here where it can be archived and you can track progress. Facebook is good for sharing what you did recently, but a forum like this is a better format for archiving and revisiting information.

There is room here to discuss competition training, drills and practice at the basic level. It can also be used to address the same topics as the pertain to defensive training. Reviews of upcoming competitions or training classes, permit classes or the like are welcome here.
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Re: Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Post by Ghostwolf308 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:23 pm

Original post by safe2carry on the old Canik Fanatik Forum

Long range rifle shooter for years and within the past year or two I started to loose interest as I had to travel far and wide for 300 yd and out shots. So relatively ( 1-2 yrs) to pistols and have had them forever but never thought seriously bout them.

My issue:

For well over a year I have been struggling with 2 eyes open and hunted the net for instructions to correct this oddity and no matter what I do I see two pistols when raising to the firing position. A footnote: I shoot bullseye and slightly droop my left eyelid and it works and it works to the extent that it allows me to focus but this process is fine for slow shooting but only for bulleye as one does not cycle the gun quickly at all in bulleye.

Fast forward 2 years and combat shooting is a horse of a different color. I'm right eye and right hand dominant. I raise pistol with 2 eyes open and I see 2 pistols no matter what I do. I could revert to drooping the left eyelid but this is just another thing to do when one needs to eliminate unnecessary steps with faster target aquisition and cycling of a pistol. I've learned to keep 2 eyes open but focus on the left hand gun in the sight picture. I think I'm cursed to live with this.

Does anyone else have this issue and how do you address it? With this drawback I doubt I can ever compete even at the lowest level albeit anything is better than nothing but my mind tells me I usually do better than average, or excel, at what I put my mind to and thus scoring at the bottom interests me little. Yes,..I know,....compete against yourself, improve and that is the reward. Problem is I'm an alpha-type.

So,..anyone see 2 guns? The fix if any? ;)
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Re: Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Post by Ghostwolf308 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:24 pm

Original post by frankw on the old Canik Fanatik Forum

Hi safe2carry,

I have the same background as you. Life long rifle shooter and only recently took up pistol shooting and trying to improve. I am 82 and always had eye problems with one eye much stronger than the other. After cataract surgery my eyesight is much improved but still have a problem shooting with both eyes open. When I try it I see the front sight and rear sight aligned with my right eye but superimposed with the sight picture I see the front sight and end of the barrel with my left eye. I just haven't found a way to see only one sight picture. Still working on it but it seems that I can shoot good groups with one eye closed or use both eyes and splatter my shots about like a blind man. :) Not sure there is a solution.

Frank
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Re: Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Post by Ghostwolf308 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:25 pm

Original post by ssgndoc on the old Canik Fanatik Forum

This video offers a 100 round drill. You can watch the whole video. Travis Haley is pretty good about discussing some of the physiologic aspects of shooting. Since this drill is up close, it can offer some ability to isolate what problems you are having with technique. This can be practiced pretty effectively with a .22.

https://youtu.be/Zi5eZqc9H7I
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Re: Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Post by Ghostwolf308 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:26 pm

Original post by poncho42 on the old Canik Fanatik Forum
Jun 2, 2017 at 5:57pm frankw said:
Hi safe2carry,

I have the same background as you. Life long rifle shooter and only recently took up pistol shooting and trying to improve. I am 82 and always had eye problems with one eye much stronger than the other. After cataract surgery my eyesight is much improved but still have a problem shooting with both eyes open. When I try it I see the front sight and rear sight aligned with my right eye but superimposed with the sight picture I see the front sight and end of the barrel with my left eye. I just haven't found a way to see only one sight picture. Still working on it but it seems that I can shoot good groups with one eye closed or use both eyes and splatter my shots about like a blind man. :) Not sure there is a solution.

Frank
Hey Frank,

Have you tried just squinting your non dominant eye? I'm still new to shooting with both eyes open and getting proper sight acquisition. but when I squint my non dominant eye just a little bit it helps me a lot. Happy shooting!
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Re: Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Post by Ghostwolf308 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:26 pm

Original post by zewkeeper912 on the old Canik Fanatik Forum

I feel your pain. I am right hand dominant but left eye dominant so it creates quite an issue when trying to get a solid sight picture quickly. I learned years ago when cross training with some Israeli soldiers of their "point" method of aiming and after incorporating some of those techniques found it worked a little better to get on target quickly at the initial onset of shooting. Once on target I found I can then squint my left eye and actually focus with my right. May work for you it may not, but it could be worth a try.
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Re: Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Post by Ghostwolf308 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:27 pm

Original post by frankw on the old Canik Fanatik Forum

Yes, I found that slightly closing my left eye eliminates the double view of the front sight. But I am a long way from shooting with both eyes open. With my age, I will probably never be a competitive shooter so not too worried about shooting with both eyes open.

Frank
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Re: Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Post by Ghostwolf308 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:28 pm

Original post by badgerboy on the old Canik Fanatik Forum
Jun 2, 2017 at 12:50pm safe2carry said:


So,..anyone see 2 guns? The fix if any? ;)
I have a much bigger problem...when I open my safe, I see 2 dozen guns.
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Re: Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Post by Ghostwolf308 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:29 pm

Original post by BentAero on the old Canik Fanatik Forum

Safe2carry,

Have you had an eye exam lately?
I was having a milder form of what you describe and finally realized some shooting-specific eye glasses might be in order. (I am a daily-use bifocal wearer.)
By asking around at local gun shops, I found an optometrist who is also a sport shooter, i.e. someone who understands what were up against. He did my eye exam with the sole intent of improving my vision while shooting. He made up a trial set of lenses that instead of being bifocals, the right lens was set for my front sight distance (about 36") and the left lens was set for normal 'long' distance. He then had me go outside while wearing the trial set and um... 'test' my vision with the intended purpose.
The result was nothing less then stunning for me. I'd never seen a front sight with such clarity, as well as seeing things 100 yards away -at the same time. It was amazing.
When I went back inside raving about the result, he told me: "I didn't want to bias you by telling you what I was planning, as only about 50% of people can tolerate a split prescription, you were either going to love it, or throw up on the sidewalk while staggering like a drunk.'
A split scrip is pretty common for contact lenses, but fairly rare for eyeglasses. It's certainly not for everyone, but it worked wonders for me in removing double vision issues.
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Re: Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Post by Ghostwolf308 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:30 pm

Original post by madduner on the old Canik Fanatik Forum
Dec 16, 2017 at 11:03pm BentAero said:
Safe2carry,

Have you had an eye exam lately?
I was having a milder form of what you describe and finally realized some shooting-specific eye glasses might be in order. (I am a daily-use bifocal wearer.)
By asking around at local gun shops, I found an optometrist who is also a sport shooter, i.e. someone who understands what were up against. He did my eye exam with the sole intent of improving my vision while shooting. He made up a trial set of lenses that instead of being bifocals, the right lens was set for my front sight distance (about 36") and the left lens was set for normal 'long' distance. He then had me go outside while wearing the trial set and um... 'test' my vision with the intended purpose.
The result was nothing less then stunning for me. I'd never seen a front sight with such clarity, as well as seeing things 100 yards away -at the same time. It was amazing.
When I went back inside raving about the result, he told me: "I didn't want to bias you by telling you what I was planning, as only about 50% of people can tolerate a split prescription, you were either going to love it, or throw up on the sidewalk while staggering like a drunk.'
A split scrip is pretty common for contact lenses, but fairly rare for eyeglasses. It's certainly not for everyone, but it worked wonders for me in removing double vision issues.


Sounds like great news!

I can't wear my prescription glasses and shoot without missing the target by a full 2' at 100yds. But amazingly I can take my glasses off and while everytghing is completely fuzzy and blurry - I can aim to the center of the blurry color and usually do pretty well. Beyond 100 yds it's gotta be a scope to make anything out at all.

As for basic shooting skills - most "newbies" aren't really capable of holding a handgun "still" to aim.
When you watch the end of the barrel - it's dancing pretty good usually.
BUT, it is possible to reduce the actual movement to a single axis.

New shooters should try to make very small vertical axis movement to keep the front sight and rear posts aligned with the center vertical axis of the target, while allowing it to "float" higher and lower. It seems to work pretty well. It also keeps them from focusing on holding it still - then pushing the barrel while squeezing the trigger.
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Re: Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Post by Ghostwolf308 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:31 pm

Original post by practicalshooter on the old Canik Fanatik Forum

A good starting model for handgun training is to follow Chris's advises at "Lucky Gunner Ammo".
My personal advice is, start at 3 yards and learn yourself and your gun.
When you master those, back out to 5 yards.
Unless sighting your gun at 15 yards, do not waist your ammo at that distance, until you become a better, faster and accurate shooter.

Lucky gunner training:
https://youtu.be/BCRkcse4WY0
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Re: Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Post by Ghostwolf308 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:32 pm

Original post by LT USN (Ret.) on the old Canik Fanatik Forum

I had posted this a while back but based on the thread topic, I wanted to add it again.
For any level shooter, this drill is good to learn your trigger and firearm or as an easy way to warm up prior to actually shooting.
I use this at the range before I send any lead down range. And, wait for it, it's free! This kind of practice does not scare the significant other & kiddies (or kitties), does not make the dog howl and best of all, does not bring the fine folks who wear blue for a living come to your front door.


The best exercise IMHO is trigger reset drills. This is the best way to learn your firearm and learn trigger control. You can first start out at home and then try it live.

AT home:
1. Triple check that firearm is unloaded. (Safety, safety, safety)
2. Aim at the wall where there is nothing on the over side and no people are (Safety, safety, safety)
3. Squeeze the trigger and HOLD IT IN
4. Rack the slide back holding the trigger in
5. SLOWLY release the trigger until you feel and/or hear the click of the reset. STOP THERE.
6. You have just reset the trigger so if you squeeze the firearm will fire.
7. Aiming in a safe direction (Safety, safety, safety) squeeze trigger.
8. Repeat often

Practice this over and over again. If you think your getting it, start either placing an empty casing or a penny just behind the front site. Practice this over and over again.

You can also see how much your front sight moves when you squeeze the trigger. If the firearm is moving about during the dry-fire exercise work on not allowing it to move.

On the range try the same drill by this time loaded. Squeeze trigger and hold, slowly release trigger until it resets, deep breath, squeeze and hold. All the time while keeping the bore of your firearm aimed down range. (Safety, safety, safety)
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Re: Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Post by Ghostwolf308 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:33 pm

Original post by practicalshooter on the old Canik Fanatik Forum
Dec 17, 2017 at 4:38pm LT USN (Ret.) said:
I had posted this a while back but based on the thread topic, I wanted to add it again.
For any level shooter, this drill is good to learn your trigger and firearm or as an easy way to warm up prior to actually shooting.
I use this at the range before I send any lead down range. And, wait for it, it's free! This kind of practice does not scare the significant other & kiddies (or kitties), does not make the dog howl and best of all, does not bring the fine folks who wear blue for a living come to your front door.


The best exercise IMHO is trigger reset drills. This is the best way to learn your firearm and learn trigger control. You can first start out at home and then try it live.

AT home:
1. Triple check that firearm is unloaded. (Safety, safety, safety)
2. Aim at the wall where there is nothing on the over side and no people are (Safety, safety, safety)
3. Squeeze the trigger and HOLD IT IN
4. Rack the slide back holding the trigger in
5. SLOWLY release the trigger until you feel and/or hear the click of the reset. STOP THERE.
6. You have just reset the trigger so if you squeeze the firearm will fire.
7. Aiming in a safe direction (Safety, safety, safety) squeeze trigger.
8. Repeat often

Practice this over and over again. If you think your getting it, start either placing an empty casing or a penny just behind the front site. Practice this over and over again.

You can also see how much your front sight moves when you squeeze the trigger. If the firearm is moving about during the dry-fire exercise work on not allowing it to move.

On the range try the same drill by this time loaded. Squeeze trigger and hold, slowly release trigger until it resets, deep breath, squeeze and hold. All the time while keeping the bore of your firearm aimed down range. (Safety, safety, safety)
I really like that one.
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Re: Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Post by Ghostwolf308 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:34 pm

Original post by GENOME747 on the old Canik Fanatik Forum

Just figured out I'm right handed left eye aiming . Sounds about right :/ I throw right handed and bat and play golf in lefty stance.
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Re: Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Post by Ghostwolf308 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:35 pm

Original post by ctd629 on the old Canik Fanatik Forum

So as someone who is new to the firearm world and just got my first pistol (tp9fs elite) what advice do you guys have as far as cheap but quality training?
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Re: Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Post by Ghostwolf308 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:36 pm

Original post by icdeadppl on the old Canik Fanatik Forum
Apr 6, 2018 at 11:13pm ctd629 said:
So as someone who is new to the firearm world and just got my first pistol (tp9fs elite) what advice do you guys have as far as cheap but quality training?


The NRA basic pistol course is a good start.
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Re: Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Post by Ghostwolf308 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:36 pm

Original post by ssgndoc on the old Canik Fanatik Forum
Apr 6, 2018 at 11:13pm ctd629 said:
So as someone who is new to the firearm world and just got my first pistol (tp9fs elite) what advice do you guys have as far as cheap but quality training?


Finding some drills you can do on your own that force you to not focus on just one aspect of shooting is good after you get basics down.

So, as mentioned above getting a good basic class would be a good place to get fundamentals taught. Then drills such as the FAST drill, and Dot torture drill can help reinforce the training you received and expand on it a bit.
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Re: Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Post by tribalhunter » Mon Jul 09, 2018 12:31 pm

I am not a good instructor but I have been taught by some great ones.

it seems to me when I am firing my sidearm, I do NOT focus on my pistol/hands or even the sights .. or in recent case.. my red dot since I have replaced my irons.
I use my peripheral vision to "see" them.. while the primary focus is on my target .. I find if I shift even a little focus to my hands/pistol I get a blur/double vision effect.
so I tend to do the .. I'm a predator thing, and focus on my target only... it is a natural way of focusing.. when you try to see/focus on "too many objects" you end up with bluring/double vision.. at least I do.

the common mistake seems to be focus on the sight window, front sight and target.. .. 3 objects .. in practice I don't do that at all, I line up front sight with the rear window, but focus on my target, and all my drills
re-inforce that.. for instance.. drawing weapon, then pushing the weapon out to eye level... so that at the end of the extension .. the weapon sights are consistently at the same place so the eye does not need to focus
on them, an example I saw recently was the youtube video Taran Butler training some newbies using the same techniques he taught Keanu Reeves for the wick movies, .. he doesn't even use his sights half the time
he just points and shoots the target which is the focus of his vision, he has soo much muscle memory discipline.. his hands/arms just go where his focus is. one day... maybe, if I am very very dedicated.. I will get there too.
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Re: Welcome to Basic shooting skills

Post by ncjw » Mon Jul 09, 2018 3:14 pm

tribalhunter wrote:
Mon Jul 09, 2018 12:31 pm
one day... maybe, if I am very very dedicated.. I will get there too.
...and you can get a movie studio to pay for your thousands of rounds of practice ammo...
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